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Online Share Trading

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Advice on strategy for long term investing

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richardw
Super Contributor
It's only condescending if you think a 'speculator' is an inferior participant to 'investor'.
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doomsdayza
Super Contributor
the term speculator is only used by investors who don't see (closed mindedness comes in here) that you don't have to be a fundamentalist to be able to call yourself an investor. then again you wouldn't find traders who would willingly call themselves investors because it's cooler to be a trader. ;/ peace richardw nice discussing with you.
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richardw
Super Contributor
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john_1
Super Contributor
But he is only that rich because he is american if he was a JAp with same stratergy his wealth in 1980 would be halved..or something like that...and how many people knew buffet in 1980 and how many people would still listern to him if he had halved their wealth...his statergy works..sure but it is also about time and place..and we is in a bear market.
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Russ
Super Contributor
If Buffett was Japanese we would still know his name but it probably wouldn't be Warren Buffett.It would be Woren Bufoto.
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Werner_1
Super Contributor
I guess it depends where he would have invested his money, maybe if he was in Japan he would have invested in the US market in 1980, one never knows... Bear markets are the best time to buy long term investments... I know some people that go around acquiring entire firms out in times like this...
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richardw
Super Contributor
It's ウォーレンバフェット氏
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Werner_1
Super Contributor
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john_1
Super Contributor
He is a fantastic investor...sure...no doubt, largly because he sticks to his stratergy and he really really understands..people,markets,economies..many things his followers know nothing about. I just think one is best served by questioning the status quo...remember that 90% of fund managers are value investors,yet most serriously underperform the market....ITS MORE ABOUT THE GRAVE YARD THEN THE WINNERS.....
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jo_soap
Contributor
I have enjoyed reading all the different posts on this thread. Just shows that it really is not a simple issue and as just mentioned you have to find your own way (but use the tools)..Just don't want to end up like a friend of mine who bought lots of Sasol at just below 500, on the advice that it would "go to 700". Still got them now. Surely that's taking the "buy and hold" to the extreme. You've got to cut your losses at some point.
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Not applicable
Well, that is where the fundamentals come into investing. At R500 Sasol was riding the crest of the oil rally. Back then everyone only saw $200 barrel oil so R700 was not impossible. However fundamentals were not inline with the reality. Share was way way over priced for the PE and other TA (Technical) points. Woulda shoulda couldnt. Point is if he has extra capital to invest he can start or should have been accumilating fromMarch lows to lwer (rand average) his costs down. However the emotional side of loosing all that cash is like swallowing a big ugly bitter pill, he did not want to repeat the exercise so now he is doing the dangerous side of BUY & HOLD, he is holding till it gets back to R500 and then he is out faster than lighting, guaranteed. The price of R500 was only 1 year ago so look at waht happened in the preceeding 5 years that will show you what to do. You did say LONG TERM PORTFOLIO and Sasol is a sound business so adding more at lower levels is a prudent thing to consider, Fundamentals vs short term corrections. In this case 1 year is short term over a 20 year investment cycle....OMO
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Shard
Super Contributor
You know... If you guys put as much effort into developing your strategy as you do into arguing that it's better, you might actually be succesful with it. Then you wouldn't need to spend hours on a forum trying to justify to everyone (& yourselves) that its superior because the justification would be in you bank account. Truth of the matter, its a zero sum game, whatever you do to put yourself on the postive side of that zero is what is working - theres more than one way to skin a cat.
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richardw
Super Contributor
How would putting money into a company and having it pay you dividends indefinitely be zero-sum? Companies can create value. They transform the inputs (money, time, materials, etc) into outputs - including more money. The money multiplier creates money. Many things in the economy aren't zero-sum.
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Werner_1
Super Contributor
Shard, our strategies are already successful, the fact that we are on the forum is that we dont need to sit and look for trading opportunities all the time, our long term investments take care of themselves and is making money without our input (all the time)... I dont think any of us said its the only way to make money, just gave our views as asked in the original comment... its my view that the other methods are 'trading' or ' 'speculation' and not 'investing' but that is only my view, and they all make money, some more risky than others though...
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zwi
Occasional Contributor
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zwi
Occasional Contributor
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louisg
Super Contributor
Shard, trading is the zero sum game. In fact, if one considers the expenses involved (including taxes) it becomes, on average, a negative sum game. The perpetual winners are the "organizers" of the game, the JSE, brokers, media, etc. I would not be surprised if the brokers made more money from fees and spreads than from actual trading profits. The "average" long term investor (on the JSE) has managed an 18,2% annual return for the past 20 years... FACT. A positive sum game.
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john_1
Super Contributor
Fact? the index has achieved that...but not many investors...FACT!! then factor in inflation and interest charges..and the Long term OKE actually made ***** all...and that in the greatest bull market known to man...but I already know you are a little slow on the uptake..or to change..LG
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Blik
Super Contributor
Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome to FIGHT NIGHT....in the Blue Corner, wearing the longs, we have the solid reliable Mr Investor....and in the Red corner, wearing the shorts we have the tencious and feisty Mr Trader...
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john_1
Super Contributor
you are right..the trader is short at the moment..but that could change by lunch time...
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