Yes. Woolies credit card business is now with ABSA and I'm also including bank credit cards when I say "credit fuelled bubble". But more to the point, looking at the PE's of these retailers, its way up in the range of 16 - 24. This is fantastically high and is probably based on the assumption that the retailers can keep up their high growth rates. Perhaps it's not exactly a fair comparison, but a company like BIL is sitting with a PE at around 7 and it's just not making sense to me. Personally, I'm not invested in BIL at the moment because I have other investments that I think are better (for my relatively small fund), but for big funds and other collective investment vehicles, I think they should start moving out of the retailers and into more defensive stocks (like BIL) before they start to feel the pain. It will fall. I don't know when but it will (when the interest rates rise). Also, I think it's better to sell too early than too late, so, I'm just really confused that the PE comparison can be so drastically different... do the fund managers know the future so well that they can afford to take such big risks (by pushing a company's PE up to 24 on the hope of future earnings growth) or are they just stupid?