so this is what a rally in a bear market looks like....

[Russ]

Dow jones futures -68. Been looking volatile through the day(was positive earlier).Not the ideal conditions for piling into stocks in my view.I don't really think anyone knows what's going on at the moment.

[#2]

no one except the guys on TV....those summit idiots were calling the bottom a few days sgo...you think they would have enough experience to see that this is not the case....

[#3]

if u can guys check the intraday charts from mon to today, volatility reins.i need some direction!

[BRE]

You've got a greater appitite for risk than me louisg, I hope you're right.

[Russ]

DOW futures now -107.

[Russ]

Ja,C,not a good time to be a fund manager right now.

[#7]

There was a recommendation to sell the DOW..

[#8]

LouisG...please dont take this personally but your post here represents what people that make money off you just love to here....the fools rush in time and time again and then get sold off....these stocks are not going to suddenly represent less opportunity tomorrow/next week of even next year....the market is a very efficient mechanism for transferring wealth from the impatient to the patient.....

[scandal]

LouisG, as chartist says the market takes from the impatient. Don't rush in at moment the market is telling you something. THE MARKET IS NEVER WRONG.

[kwagga]

We are in for a very rough ride. I suspect that the financial blow off and credit crunch is going to be much bigger that some would like us to believe. This is a symptom of a bigger problem. The US Federal Reserve is not as transparent as we all believe and are pacifying everyone to hide the truth of the state of the US economy. In fact I think the US economy and monetary system is on a knife's edge. When the worlds largest lenders keep liquidity running with borrowed money from large foreign private equity funds, but continue massive write off's, then you know the buck will stop somewhere. The US has been printing money on a massive scale to fund their unsustainable debt written economy for a few decades now. They are selling everything they own to fund their exuberant way of living - hotels, companies, land etc. Look out for the last resort of the Federal Reserve - higher interest rates. We are seriously looking as recession, stagflation and finally depression. Before then many suckers will be drawn into world markets just to see there hard earned cash disappear as markets takes a turn for the worse.

[kwagga]

Freddie, Fannie and Paulson. Three names we'll get to know a lot better in future.

[louisg]

Chartist, no offence taken. However, I have stated that I'm a long term investor. I have no idea where the prices of my shares will be one week, one month or one year from now. You may be right that I have bought too early, BUT in my opinion I have bought great companies with good economic prospects at better than fair prices. I'm ungeared so there is no pressure for me to sell out, so I am not sure how someone else is going to make money from me. Chartist please explain your thinking.

[louisg]

Scandal, I hate to burst your bubble but the market is not ALWAYS right. How do you explain, for example, a share (or the market)being overbought or oversold. If the market is efficient this should NEVER occur. History have showed us that sometimes the market gets it wrong in the short term.

[louisg]

2 quotes from Warren buffet on market efficiency: "I'd be a bum on the street with a tin cup if the markets were always efficient." "Investing in a market where people believe in efficiency is like playing bridge with someone who has been told it doesn't do any good to look at the cards."

[john_1]

Absolutly. However, as a result of this in efficient market the place to find value is at the end of a negative cycle and the least likly place to find value is at the end of a possitive cycle. So if this is the top or near top, it is the place most likly to present itself as value (as PE will will look low realitive to the possitive historic earnings(top of a bull cycle) but in truth represent a clasic Bull trap...the place were "value" investors take the sucker puch. No offence to you LG but value investors were buying in 2002 and selling in 2007-8

[john_1]

History has showed us that sometimes the market gets it wrong in the short term. Phrased diffrently would read " with the benifit of hindsight the guys who acted in the present may have got it wrong." However nobody ever made money in hidsight and based on the present info at the present time the market is doing the best it can to be effiecient. Its basic problem however is that a market place is made up of individuals who are flawed, resistant to change, oppose anything that confronts their veiw of reality, are highly emotional and don't know it. Outside of that the market is always right. The alternative is also not always effeicent which is to ignore all evidence that you have made a bad choice and come back to look in 20 years and hope like hell you have made a profit. This is called long term investmet.

[#17]

you see ...everyone would like to think they could be value investors but all they are most of the time are Johnny come latelys who fool themselves they are value investors....all they are are usually ppl that are stupid enough to go against the trend......it takes the extraordinary dullness/prudence/parsimony/patience and early luck in life of someone like Buffet to be a true value investor....you need to have para human delayed gratification and very few needs in life except to acquire meaningless wealth

[louisg]

Chartist you have not answered how you are going to make money from me (the fool as you like to call it)because I have invested in SBK at 7500c for the long term. In property it is POSITION POSITION POSITION and in value investing it is PATIENCE PATIENCE PATIENCE.

[louisg]

John if you believe that long term investing is about buying a share and then not monitoring the company's progress while you are invested in the company, I'm afraid you do not understand the general idea of investing. It is certainly NOT,in your words, "coming back to look in 20 years and hope like hell you have made a profit". Why can't you techies accept that there are other ways to make money in the market other than technical analysis.

[john_1]

I would be more than happy to accept that there are other ways of making money if you were actually making money, why can't the fundamentalist understand that FA tells you nothing about timing and that with the most basic of tools: a chart, a trendline and some common sense they would be more effective in the market place.